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	<title>Comments on: Could some nanoparticles inflict harm across normally tight biological barriers?</title>
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	<link>http://2020science.org/2009/11/05/could-nanoparticles-inflict-harm-across-tight-cellular-barriers/</link>
	<description>Providing a clear perspective on developing science and technology responsibly</description>
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		<title>By: Andrew Maynard</title>
		<link>http://2020science.org/2009/11/05/could-nanoparticles-inflict-harm-across-tight-cellular-barriers/comment-page-1/#comment-35860</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Maynard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 20:27:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://2020science.org/?p=2362#comment-35860</guid>
		<description>I think this is a big knowledge gap - between scientists, as well as scientists and others - although I&#039;m not sure how best to fill it.  

I think there are probably a couple of issues here - understanding why something is done in the way that it is, and understanding the dangers of mis-framing a piece of research.  For example, a study using high doses might offer insight into specific modes of action within biological systems, while not being designed to shed light on toxicity.  If the study is either evaluated as a toxicity study, or promoted as such, there is a great deal of room for misunderstanding.  

How you deal with this, beyond making it very clear what the context of the research was, I&#039;m not sure.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think this is a big knowledge gap &#8211; between scientists, as well as scientists and others &#8211; although I&#8217;m not sure how best to fill it.  </p>
<p>I think there are probably a couple of issues here &#8211; understanding why something is done in the way that it is, and understanding the dangers of mis-framing a piece of research.  For example, a study using high doses might offer insight into specific modes of action within biological systems, while not being designed to shed light on toxicity.  If the study is either evaluated as a toxicity study, or promoted as such, there is a great deal of room for misunderstanding.  </p>
<p>How you deal with this, beyond making it very clear what the context of the research was, I&#8217;m not sure.</p>
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		<title>By: Luisa Filipponi</title>
		<link>http://2020science.org/2009/11/05/could-nanoparticles-inflict-harm-across-tight-cellular-barriers/comment-page-1/#comment-35817</link>
		<dc:creator>Luisa Filipponi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 11:23:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://2020science.org/?p=2362#comment-35817</guid>
		<description>Dear Andrew,
thanks for yet another good review. I like the way you reflect critically on science, it is really inspiring.

In my case, this article made me think that very often those studies (as you have commented above) use very high concentrations of NPs/chemicals to get a measurable effect. Althought this might obvious for a scientist, the &quot;public&quot; struggles in understanding the role of dose (and exposure) in those studies. I dealt in the past with NGOs and in their talks they gave for granted that toxicological studies use concentrations of NPs to which people would be likely to be exposed to. This si a big knowledge gap! What can we do to fill the gap? Is it totally unrealistic to ask that reseachers doing these experiment to always do a &quot;real-life&quot; control experiment with a more realistic dose? Maybe more a comment then a question...

Luisa</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Andrew,<br />
thanks for yet another good review. I like the way you reflect critically on science, it is really inspiring.</p>
<p>In my case, this article made me think that very often those studies (as you have commented above) use very high concentrations of NPs/chemicals to get a measurable effect. Althought this might obvious for a scientist, the &#8220;public&#8221; struggles in understanding the role of dose (and exposure) in those studies. I dealt in the past with NGOs and in their talks they gave for granted that toxicological studies use concentrations of NPs to which people would be likely to be exposed to. This si a big knowledge gap! What can we do to fill the gap? Is it totally unrealistic to ask that reseachers doing these experiment to always do a &#8220;real-life&#8221; control experiment with a more realistic dose? Maybe more a comment then a question&#8230;</p>
<p>Luisa</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Maynard</title>
		<link>http://2020science.org/2009/11/05/could-nanoparticles-inflict-harm-across-tight-cellular-barriers/comment-page-1/#comment-35777</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Maynard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 01:05:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://2020science.org/?p=2362#comment-35777</guid>
		<description>Apologies for the slow response Marty.  Eyeballing the data (fig 1 b &amp; c in the paper), introducing either 0.04 µM or 0.4 µM Cr6+ or 0.4 µM Co2+ ions led to a response in the Comet assay that was around half that of either the nano-sized or micrometer-sized CoCr particles (concentrations 0.036 mg/cm2 and 0.36 mg/cm2).  However, the response was still significant, compared to the control.

There was surprisingly little difference in response between the nano- and micro- particles, or between the two different doses (whether using small or large particles, or ions) - which I find worrying from an experimental design perspective.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Apologies for the slow response Marty.  Eyeballing the data (fig 1 b &#038; c in the paper), introducing either 0.04 µM or 0.4 µM Cr6+ or 0.4 µM Co2+ ions led to a response in the Comet assay that was around half that of either the nano-sized or micrometer-sized CoCr particles (concentrations 0.036 mg/cm2 and 0.36 mg/cm2).  However, the response was still significant, compared to the control.</p>
<p>There was surprisingly little difference in response between the nano- and micro- particles, or between the two different doses (whether using small or large particles, or ions) &#8211; which I find worrying from an experimental design perspective.</p>
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		<title>By: GNTIS &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Nanoparticles damage DNA</title>
		<link>http://2020science.org/2009/11/05/could-nanoparticles-inflict-harm-across-tight-cellular-barriers/comment-page-1/#comment-35709</link>
		<dc:creator>GNTIS &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Nanoparticles damage DNA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 04:08:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://2020science.org/?p=2362#comment-35709</guid>
		<description>[...] can damage DNA even when there is a barrier between the particles and the cells, Andrew Maynard in 2020 Science provides a nice commentary about the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] can damage DNA even when there is a barrier between the particles and the cells, Andrew Maynard in 2020 Science provides a nice commentary about the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: marty</title>
		<link>http://2020science.org/2009/11/05/could-nanoparticles-inflict-harm-across-tight-cellular-barriers/comment-page-1/#comment-35555</link>
		<dc:creator>marty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 21:28:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://2020science.org/?p=2362#comment-35555</guid>
		<description>I can&#039;t access the full article. What was the effect of Co or Cr ions (as opposed to metallic nanoparticles)?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can&#8217;t access the full article. What was the effect of Co or Cr ions (as opposed to metallic nanoparticles)?</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Maynard</title>
		<link>http://2020science.org/2009/11/05/could-nanoparticles-inflict-harm-across-tight-cellular-barriers/comment-page-1/#comment-35499</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Maynard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 02:51:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://2020science.org/?p=2362#comment-35499</guid>
		<description>Thanks Ruth.

Something that is reasonably common in research like this is that you use large quantities of material to give you a measurable effect.  It&#039;s an approach that can provide insight into biological mechanisms, but the results are often hard to relate to real-world conditions without further research.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Ruth.</p>
<p>Something that is reasonably common in research like this is that you use large quantities of material to give you a measurable effect.  It&#8217;s an approach that can provide insight into biological mechanisms, but the results are often hard to relate to real-world conditions without further research.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Maynard</title>
		<link>http://2020science.org/2009/11/05/could-nanoparticles-inflict-harm-across-tight-cellular-barriers/comment-page-1/#comment-35498</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Maynard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 02:47:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://2020science.org/?p=2362#comment-35498</guid>
		<description>Thanks Anthony,

I think the good news here is that the more we know about how materials like nanoparticles and metal ions interact with biological systems, the better positioned we are to use these interactions for good, and avoid inadvertently causing harm.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Anthony,</p>
<p>I think the good news here is that the more we know about how materials like nanoparticles and metal ions interact with biological systems, the better positioned we are to use these interactions for good, and avoid inadvertently causing harm.</p>
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		<title>By: Ruth Seeley</title>
		<link>http://2020science.org/2009/11/05/could-nanoparticles-inflict-harm-across-tight-cellular-barriers/comment-page-1/#comment-35490</link>
		<dc:creator>Ruth Seeley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 00:32:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://2020science.org/?p=2362#comment-35490</guid>
		<description>I love the way you explain things.

How strange that the quantities used in this study should have been so large. It&#039;s as if the researchers were going on a premise similar to &#039;our bodies absorb Vitamin D from sunshine and we need Vitamin D, so let&#039;s see what happens when we give people 24 hours a day of sunshine rather than just the 10-20 minutes one needs to get one&#039;s recommended daily dose.&#039;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love the way you explain things.</p>
<p>How strange that the quantities used in this study should have been so large. It&#8217;s as if the researchers were going on a premise similar to &#8216;our bodies absorb Vitamin D from sunshine and we need Vitamin D, so let&#8217;s see what happens when we give people 24 hours a day of sunshine rather than just the 10-20 minutes one needs to get one&#8217;s recommended daily dose.&#8217;</p>
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		<title>By: Anthony Zelinko</title>
		<link>http://2020science.org/2009/11/05/could-nanoparticles-inflict-harm-across-tight-cellular-barriers/comment-page-1/#comment-35451</link>
		<dc:creator>Anthony Zelinko</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Nov 2009 18:33:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://2020science.org/?p=2362#comment-35451</guid>
		<description>This is interesting I was commenting on the dangers  of the use of aluminum in vaccines to a colleague who is a physician and I came across some studies that would support your findings. It has been shown that the ionic charge of the metals can cause damage to the outer cell wall of neuroblastoma cells. It appears the presence of the charged disrupts the K+ and ionic channels in the cell outer membrane. The study also showed the presence of the aluminum disrupts the cell inner integrity. The metal doesn&#039;t have to cross cell  cellular barrier to cause damage. 
I would suggest that the ionic nature of nanomettalic particles be more thoroughly studied before being used in the field and commercialized. I also suggest that the previous study  be conducted using nanomettalic particles that are bound and don&#039;t have a charge. I bet you will find little if any cell disruption or DNA damage. I would hope this approach allows for the use of metallic nanoparticles in the treatment for diseases. 
Just someone Who Cares!
Anthony Zelinko</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is interesting I was commenting on the dangers  of the use of aluminum in vaccines to a colleague who is a physician and I came across some studies that would support your findings. It has been shown that the ionic charge of the metals can cause damage to the outer cell wall of neuroblastoma cells. It appears the presence of the charged disrupts the K+ and ionic channels in the cell outer membrane. The study also showed the presence of the aluminum disrupts the cell inner integrity. The metal doesn&#8217;t have to cross cell  cellular barrier to cause damage.<br />
I would suggest that the ionic nature of nanomettalic particles be more thoroughly studied before being used in the field and commercialized. I also suggest that the previous study  be conducted using nanomettalic particles that are bound and don&#8217;t have a charge. I bet you will find little if any cell disruption or DNA damage. I would hope this approach allows for the use of metallic nanoparticles in the treatment for diseases.<br />
Just someone Who Cares!<br />
Anthony Zelinko</p>
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